<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Why Are Markets So Scary? Some Things (Liberal) Academics Get Wrong</title>
	<atom:link href="http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/</link>
	<description>Economics of organizations, strategy, entrepreneurship, innovation, and more</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 05:23:40 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=MU</generator>
		<item>
		<title>By: dhoopes</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-60223</link>
		<dc:creator>dhoopes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Nov 2007 20:01:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-60223</guid>
		<description>I would probably get more comments if I HAD said that markets are sexy.  However, with a few notable exceptions I don't think too many markets are sexy.

Most people who like the idea of planned economies have not had to live in one (or so I would guess).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would probably get more comments if I HAD said that markets are sexy.  However, with a few notable exceptions I don&#8217;t think too many markets are sexy.</p>
<p>Most people who like the idea of planned economies have not had to live in one (or so I would guess).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Vladimir Dzhuvinov</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-60219</link>
		<dc:creator>Vladimir Dzhuvinov</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Nov 2007 19:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-60219</guid>
		<description>"Why are markets so sexy" -- what an interesting post, I thought, but then I put my glasses on and "sexy" became "scary" :-(

I've spent almost a third of my life in a "planned economy" and now I sing hymns of praise to the heavens that the bloody thing collapsed, at least in our part of the world.

But to think the demon of the centralised economy is slain would be a gross fallacy. It is still very much alive, even in a "capitalist" country like the US. If you don't believe me just enter the HQ of a big corporation and ask yourself the question: "what is the economy of this place?"</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Why are markets so sexy&#8221; &#8212; what an interesting post, I thought, but then I put my glasses on and &#8220;sexy&#8221; became &#8220;scary&#8221; :-(</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve spent almost a third of my life in a &#8220;planned economy&#8221; and now I sing hymns of praise to the heavens that the bloody thing collapsed, at least in our part of the world.</p>
<p>But to think the demon of the centralised economy is slain would be a gross fallacy. It is still very much alive, even in a &#8220;capitalist&#8221; country like the US. If you don&#8217;t believe me just enter the HQ of a big corporation and ask yourself the question: &#8220;what is the economy of this place?&#8221;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: links for 2007-10-15 at Jacob Christensen</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55199</link>
		<dc:creator>links for 2007-10-15 at Jacob Christensen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Oct 2007 12:27:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55199</guid>
		<description>[...] Why Are Markets So Scary? Some Things (Liberal) Academics Get Wrong « Organizations and Markets &#8230;many people think of capitalism and think of centralized power (big corporations). Yet, the whole point of capitalism is to allow each individual to choose what to buy, where to work, how much to pay, how to spend their time so and so forth. (tags: economics academic liberalism) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Why Are Markets So Scary? Some Things (Liberal) Academics Get Wrong « Organizations and Markets &#8230;many people think of capitalism and think of centralized power (big corporations). Yet, the whole point of capitalism is to allow each individual to choose what to buy, where to work, how much to pay, how to spend their time so and so forth. (tags: economics academic liberalism) [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: twofish</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55099</link>
		<dc:creator>twofish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Oct 2007 17:39:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55099</guid>
		<description>Matt: Regardless of which corporation I choose to work for, I’m working for the same end – and because of the concentration of share ownership, there’s a good chance I’m working for literally the same people.

However in a market economy, I'm also working for my own interests which are in some ways fundamentally opposite to that of the corporation.  The more money goes into my bank account, the less money goes into the bank account of the shareholders.

There is this tension between my personal self-interest and those of the corporation that exists in the context of a market economy that makes working within a corporation different from working within a planned economy.  

I think a lot of the problem with what is written in academia is that it doesn't take into account the *intra-corporate* politics.  I am not a mindless automaton working for the good of the shareholders, I have my own direct personal interests which fundamentally conflict with those of the shareholders.  Also, in day to day work, the interests of the shareholders are so far removed from what I do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Matt: Regardless of which corporation I choose to work for, I’m working for the same end – and because of the concentration of share ownership, there’s a good chance I’m working for literally the same people.</p>
<p>However in a market economy, I&#8217;m also working for my own interests which are in some ways fundamentally opposite to that of the corporation.  The more money goes into my bank account, the less money goes into the bank account of the shareholders.</p>
<p>There is this tension between my personal self-interest and those of the corporation that exists in the context of a market economy that makes working within a corporation different from working within a planned economy.  </p>
<p>I think a lot of the problem with what is written in academia is that it doesn&#8217;t take into account the *intra-corporate* politics.  I am not a mindless automaton working for the good of the shareholders, I have my own direct personal interests which fundamentally conflict with those of the shareholders.  Also, in day to day work, the interests of the shareholders are so far removed from what I do.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: twofish</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55098</link>
		<dc:creator>twofish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Oct 2007 17:27:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55098</guid>
		<description>There is absolutely no legal requirement that a corporation be run to maximize profit, and some states (like New York) explicitly put in their corporate law that the board of directors can make whatever charitable donations that the wish.

Personally, I *don't* think that profit maximization is a good description of corporate behavior.  The main driver of corporate behavior is "bankruptcy avoidance" which is different.  You can maximize profit by increasing risk, and so if you are focused on maximizing profits, the logical thing to do is to go out and buy lottery tickets.  Also, if a board of directors doesn't want to maximize profits, there is nothing that can practically be done in legal terms.

Bankruptcy avoidance is different.  If a company goes broke, then it dies.

Also, the reason that corporations do end up trying to make money is that that's often "making the most money" is the only thing that the people on the board can agree on.  I have a list of social goals that I think people ought to spend things on.  You have yours.  Someone else has there.  If we end up on the same board of directors, the only thing that we are likely to agree on is to make a profit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is absolutely no legal requirement that a corporation be run to maximize profit, and some states (like New York) explicitly put in their corporate law that the board of directors can make whatever charitable donations that the wish.</p>
<p>Personally, I *don&#8217;t* think that profit maximization is a good description of corporate behavior.  The main driver of corporate behavior is &#8220;bankruptcy avoidance&#8221; which is different.  You can maximize profit by increasing risk, and so if you are focused on maximizing profits, the logical thing to do is to go out and buy lottery tickets.  Also, if a board of directors doesn&#8217;t want to maximize profits, there is nothing that can practically be done in legal terms.</p>
<p>Bankruptcy avoidance is different.  If a company goes broke, then it dies.</p>
<p>Also, the reason that corporations do end up trying to make money is that that&#8217;s often &#8220;making the most money&#8221; is the only thing that the people on the board can agree on.  I have a list of social goals that I think people ought to spend things on.  You have yours.  Someone else has there.  If we end up on the same board of directors, the only thing that we are likely to agree on is to make a profit.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: twofish</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55097</link>
		<dc:creator>twofish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Oct 2007 17:18:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55097</guid>
		<description>Meh: I’ll believe markets are less scary the day economists like you get a job in a less protected market than academia. Until then, I’ll continue to believe the evidence that suggests the brightest economists avoid submitting themselves to market forces as far as possible.

Ummmm...  There are lot of bright economists in the corporate world.  Fisher Black just to name one.  The typical quantitative research department in a major Wall Street investment bank has got about 50 or so physics and math Ph.D.'s working for them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Meh: I’ll believe markets are less scary the day economists like you get a job in a less protected market than academia. Until then, I’ll continue to believe the evidence that suggests the brightest economists avoid submitting themselves to market forces as far as possible.</p>
<p>Ummmm&#8230;  There are lot of bright economists in the corporate world.  Fisher Black just to name one.  The typical quantitative research department in a major Wall Street investment bank has got about 50 or so physics and math Ph.D.&#8217;s working for them.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: twofish</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55096</link>
		<dc:creator>twofish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Oct 2007 17:09:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55096</guid>
		<description>Something that people also miss the that power *within* a large corporation is very decentralized.  One reason that I've ended up in the corporate world is that I end up with far more real freedom and choices than I would have in academia.  Academia is wonderful for people on top but it depends on the exploitation of a lot of serfs.  

By contrast, I'm at the bottom of the corporate hierarchy and things are a lot of fun here.  I don't feel like a serf or an adjunct faculty.  Part of the reason for this is that if I am unhappy and someone offers me a better role, I leave.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Something that people also miss the that power *within* a large corporation is very decentralized.  One reason that I&#8217;ve ended up in the corporate world is that I end up with far more real freedom and choices than I would have in academia.  Academia is wonderful for people on top but it depends on the exploitation of a lot of serfs.  </p>
<p>By contrast, I&#8217;m at the bottom of the corporate hierarchy and things are a lot of fun here.  I don&#8217;t feel like a serf or an adjunct faculty.  Part of the reason for this is that if I am unhappy and someone offers me a better role, I leave.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: David Hoopes</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55092</link>
		<dc:creator>David Hoopes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Oct 2007 15:07:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55092</guid>
		<description>More on Smith (and James Q.):  Smith thought there were five moral issues relating to open markets.  He did not believe that there were no potential problems.  He was concerned about the laziness and indulgence of the wealthy classes, he was concerned that merchants would collude.  His critique of the system he advocated is substantially better than most modern critiques.  Again, for a great summary see James Q. Wilson's California Management Review paper.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>More on Smith (and James Q.):  Smith thought there were five moral issues relating to open markets.  He did not believe that there were no potential problems.  He was concerned about the laziness and indulgence of the wealthy classes, he was concerned that merchants would collude.  His critique of the system he advocated is substantially better than most modern critiques.  Again, for a great summary see James Q. Wilson&#8217;s California Management Review paper.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: David Hoopes</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55091</link>
		<dc:creator>David Hoopes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Oct 2007 15:02:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55091</guid>
		<description>Meh:  Academics do compete in an international market.  Very bright hard working people from all over the world come to the U.S. to get Ph.D.s and to stay on at universities.  

I think most academics see this as a good thing because all of this brain-power increases the quality of our universities.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Meh:  Academics do compete in an international market.  Very bright hard working people from all over the world come to the U.S. to get Ph.D.s and to stay on at universities.  </p>
<p>I think most academics see this as a good thing because all of this brain-power increases the quality of our universities.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: srp</title>
		<link>http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55058</link>
		<dc:creator>srp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Oct 2007 23:21:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://organizationsandmarkets.com/2007/10/11/why-are-markets-so-scary-some-things-liberal-academics-get-wrong/#comment-55058</guid>
		<description>As a factual matter, there is nothing stopping coops or other alternative institutional forms from entering various markets and trying to compete with corporations. We already have a vast "non-profit" sector that often implicitly competes with corporations, is less regulated, and pays lower taxes. (The NFIB regularly bitches about competition from universtiy bookstores and the like. Think about for-profit hospitals and educators and what they're up against.)

As for for-profit corporations, they can always place in their charters various objectives other than profit. So long as investors are informed of these objectives, there is no legal reason it couldn't work. No legal doctrine prevents me from starting the XYZ Moral Sentiment Co. that makes shoes and guarantees that it only uses union workers in domestic factories. Of course, it will receive no funding from rational investors and/or go out of business pretty quickly unless it can convince customers to pay a lot more for its "morally superior" product. (Lots of people might question whether not employing desperately poor people overseas at higher wages than they would otherwise receive is really "moral," but that's a discussion for another time.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a factual matter, there is nothing stopping coops or other alternative institutional forms from entering various markets and trying to compete with corporations. We already have a vast &#8220;non-profit&#8221; sector that often implicitly competes with corporations, is less regulated, and pays lower taxes. (The NFIB regularly bitches about competition from universtiy bookstores and the like. Think about for-profit hospitals and educators and what they&#8217;re up against.)</p>
<p>As for for-profit corporations, they can always place in their charters various objectives other than profit. So long as investors are informed of these objectives, there is no legal reason it couldn&#8217;t work. No legal doctrine prevents me from starting the XYZ Moral Sentiment Co. that makes shoes and guarantees that it only uses union workers in domestic factories. Of course, it will receive no funding from rational investors and/or go out of business pretty quickly unless it can convince customers to pay a lot more for its &#8220;morally superior&#8221; product. (Lots of people might question whether not employing desperately poor people overseas at higher wages than they would otherwise receive is really &#8220;moral,&#8221; but that&#8217;s a discussion for another time.)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
